Curse

Snowman · May 03, 2006, 02:04 PM // 14:04

Its easier for Ritualists to get groups than it is for assasins!

I think there are definatly more assasins than rits, and having a good rit + monk hench is an excelent mix!

Thumbs up for rits ! at last a monk alternative (okay maybe not as good as a monk in pure healing but definatly the next best thing)

Da Cebuano · May 03, 2006, 02:06 PM // 14:06

Man, I can't even begin to tell you guys how I was hurting for a mesmer during faction farming for kurzick -_- that freaking ele boss is horrible, and domination henchie spams empathy >:| I even thought of making a mesmer myself, infact I will, I'll go delete my assassin for a ritualist then make a mesmer once my mule has all unloaded her stuff, then when I have the time, probly buy a slot to make an assassin, but even then I doubt it, I can't see much productive future for assassins for any career other than questing. Its its for melee in pvp, I'd rather go as warrior and be more flexible.

Rits are awesome, they are very flexible, a group w/ 2 warrs 1 necro 1 mesmer 2 rits 2 monks can pretty much clear anything. 1 monk prot, 1 heal 1 rit heal 1 rit channeling. I can't even begin to express my disappointment for assassins so far, softie that has to be in the front line, even w/ buffs they die very quickly, although I can see them being good at capable hands, they still aren't as flexible and have to be build around its weaknesses instead of going for its str.

SpeedyKQ · May 03, 2006, 02:08 PM // 14:08

It seems my mesmer gets in groups mainly by virtue of being a not-an-assassin.

I haven't tried it yet, but healing rits SEEM like they ought to be pretty good. Lively was Naomei (rez everyone on drop) + Soothing Memories (heal 106 for 2 energy with 16 restoration) would be decent, no?

Mr_T_bot · May 03, 2006, 02:20 PM // 14:20

I'm going to guess the team totem for non-desired classes.
Ritualist > Mesmer > Assassin > Prince Rurik > Monk with even a single smiting skill, God help you if you have more than one.

I cannot count the number of times I have been alled a n00b or kicked from a group because I had one or two smiting skills on a bar decked out healing. I could be the only monk on the team, everyone could live, and if I had a smiting skill, I'm the n00b and I'm getting the boot.

Nirvy · May 03, 2006, 02:27 PM // 14:27

Thanks for you answers!

Seems i'll respec as a protective Rit with the odd heal for emergencies. Hopefully people will realise Rit's have their uses now. Until then i'll keep groping with other miss-matched classes, and doing suprisingly well considering people dont want us :P

Just done a challenge mission with the wierdest group of people who couldnt get into other groups, and we kicked arse so much. So much for *having* to have certain classes to be successful

boxcarracers052 · May 03, 2006, 02:35 PM // 14:35

I've been leading many groups and I'll let any ritualist in that uses any restoration skills, THEY DO HELP. Of course, here I am at rank 6 looking for 3+ people in pve, too

Funk Master Snuggs · May 03, 2006, 02:42 PM // 14:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Effendi Westland

Even so, still easier for a ritualist or assasin to get into a group then a mesmer.......

I take Mesmers over Assassins, unless there isnt a mesmer in the district. As least I dont have to worry about healing the Mesmer as often in the backline. Damn soft target Assassins.

Trin Storm · May 03, 2006, 02:44 PM // 14:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by felinette

I've seen lots of groups calling for anything but rits and assassins, but my rit hasn't had a problem grouping yet.

A lot of this is just due to volume - parties ofen end up with one or two of each and start looking for other stuff.

coolsti · May 03, 2006, 02:48 PM // 14:48

To the O.P.: if getting into groups concerns you, and is giving you difficulty, the best thing you can do is join a good guild. A guild where the members are mostly interested in adventuring and playing the PvE part of this game.

You find a good guild, you will never have problems finding parties and nice people to team up with. And it won't matter then which character you are playing.

Lasher Dragon · May 03, 2006, 02:57 PM // 14:57

Ignorance and elitism abound in this game. I remember when Prophecies was in it's first month or so NOBODY wanted rangers, they were seen as useless. As a matter of fact, IIRC, rangers didn't get the PVE respect they deserve until people started going on all-ranger UW trips and completely owning it.

Anyway, my point is that 90% of the people "know" what classes are "best", and what builds are "best", and god forbid you have anything original or creative.

Yeah I'm a bit cynical hehe. Comes from playing Ranger for so long I guess. At least I know I can solo almost anywhere.

Oh well, could be worse, at least Mesmer isn't my favorite.

edit: oh yeah, to be a bit more on-topic, I really like Ritualists. They have some killer heals and the protective abilities are insane. I have been in parties with just Rit healers, and if they are good it goes just fine.

Loch · May 03, 2006, 03:13 PM // 15:13

The optimal party wouldn't rely solely on a restoration Ritualist, but instead use the Ritualist as healer support, similar to the Ether Prodigy-powered Heal Party spamming Elementalist (only, of course, with more healing tricks than the ele). But PvE doesn't require optimal parties, and therefore, perhaps having one or two restoration Ritualists is enough, as long as people play with some intelligence.

Just like dagger Assassins will never replace the Warrior's role, the restoration Ritualist will never replace the Monk's role.

lauriepriest · May 03, 2006, 03:19 PM // 15:19

If you see a group not leting people in because they are a certain class they are not worth joining.

Esprit · May 03, 2006, 03:20 PM // 15:20

It will take a bit before people start trying groups besides the those true and tried formations.

frojack · May 03, 2006, 03:48 PM // 15:48

Ok. First of all, Ritualists are not monks. If they were as strong as monks for healing, they would be a pointless addition to the game. I like the fact that their a hybrid class. With their own unique quirks, I have enjoyed using mine immensely.
If I don't want to heal, I don't have to. I like healing healing others but I don't want that to be my only role. As a monk, that would be my only option (with the current state of the game). Ritualists have many skills that appear dull at first, but are in-fact very cunningly specced. A good example is Weapon of Warding:

At high enough Restoration (15) it will last 11 seconds. It has a 50% chance to block attacks (both melee AND ranged). That's 50% chance of being pysically interupted right there (not counting knockdown).

Or Spirit of Life. 150 hp to everyone every 45 seconds sounds lame. Until you factor in the range. It's a nice battle refresher. Plus it has hidden benefits. It works on minions! Yes, your little necro palls get healed aswell.
Spirit of Recuperation operates in a similar fashion. Granting up to +3 regen for everyone in the party including the minions.
It's nice getting thanked at the end of a mission by the Necro's for keeping their little buddies alive

.

There's just so much there...

Zephro · May 03, 2006, 04:23 PM // 16:23

If you can't get in a group, just make one yourself! Much better, IMO. I regularly take in Mesmers and other ignored classes

linh · May 03, 2006, 04:25 PM // 16:25

Firstly, to the topic title, you compare Ritualist to Monk for getting a group in which point ? Of course, monk is best and specific class to heal and protect so people will choose Monk if they need healing.

And we can't compare 2 classes by a specific role. Ritualist can't heal like monks, can't do high damage like Elementalist, their spirits can't compare to minions to control battle. Does it mean Ritualist is useless ? No. Ritualist is hybrid class and it supports very well for team. So Ritualist can quite easily find a team when people know more about its role and its power.

Astraea Zopyros · May 03, 2006, 04:48 PM // 16:48

I have been running a Rt/N for several days now, and am just now getting the "hang" of it. I recently switched to Rt/Mo for the benefit of the greater healing powers, but maintained the "protective" spirits, such as Shadowsong and Union. It's obvious that a Ritualist is not a primary healer, there just simply are not strong enough, spammable skills like with a Monk. As everyone else has said, a Ritualist is a versatile class.

On another note, I have done several missions thus far with an overwhelming number of Ritualists and Assassins. One mission, our party was 3 assassins and 5 ritualists. Sure, we died a lot, but with 5-ish people carrying 5 second res's, and spirits to help out once res'd, we completed the mission easily.

On the "weakness" of the Assassin class. My roommate plays an assassin currently. At first, she had a lot of trouble staying alive--assassins really are "squishy" compared to tanks. However, as she has learned the class, I find she increasingly is taking fewer and fewer hits. It's not that Assassins are necessarily weak, I believe it is simply that we have not had time yet to learn how to work the build. Either you have previously played a tank, so you try to tank (bad idea with an assassin), or you have previously been a ranged fighter, so you assume you *need* to tank. Once people have learned the "pop in-pop out" tricks, the success of assassins will greatly raise.

Imaginos · May 03, 2006, 05:11 PM // 17:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nirvy

Ok im fairly new to the game, and i have a 20 Rit/Mo with most of my points in restoration. I Feel i heal pretty good as a ritualist, but getting a group, well its very hard. People dont ask for Healers, they just ask for monks. Some groups let me in, and suddently tell me im not a healer (Hmm wonder what my 30+ resortation heals are for then?) Or they tell me i cant heal as a good as a proper healer!

Are restoration specced Rit/Mo 's that much worse than an appropriate specced monk?

I've even takent o levelling up a Mo/Rt and i get so many more groups, even for a laugh i put all my points in the Rir's skills and took zero monk heals only the Rit's heals and i still got thanked for being a good healer, this coming from a group who told me to log into my monk, as a Rit isnt a healer!!

So is it just ignorance, is it just people scared to break the Tank/monk/nuker magic group i see everyone asking for? My progress in the Canthan missions has ground to a halt, as im not seen as a healer.

Anyone else seen this, and also will this perception change when people realise what a Resto Rt can do, or what a protective spirit Rt can do?

The reason that people want rit healers less then mo healers is that rits, do not get an inherent bonus to healing via divine favor and in the divine favor tree is the skill divine boon. These 2 make a monk healer far outshine a rit healer primary.

The second reason is that people are just not used to rits yet and are unsure of what they can do.

Example

A Rit casts Orison of healing with a 10 in heal prayers (as a rit/mo) and they heal for 53 a pop. I don't see a rit skill that makes this spell any better.

A monk casts Orison of healing with a 10 in heal prayers and a 10 in divine favor with divine boon and they heal for 53+32+55 = 140

The monk heals for more then 2x what you can hope to heal for, using the same amount of mana. Even without divine boon they are adding nearly double your heal power.

The thing that rits have on their side is that the spirits they can cast have a longer duration then some of the spells a monk can cast, but the spirits are killable and take a long time to cast / refresh in some cases.

Xeeron · May 03, 2006, 05:12 PM // 17:12

I have played a pure (not using any secondary skills) ritualist from the beginning of Factions and I had no problems at all. Finding a group as a restoration Rt is very easy compared to all other classes apart from heal monks and MM. Very often I also started the group with my Rt and found people as easily as with my monk. Generally, I found the further developed parts of the story line quite lacking in any heals, so half of the time my Rt was solo healing character (together with a hench) and groups loved me being around.

In terms of Monks > Rt, I'd say that since Rt is very new, most people will not have found the right combinations there, but whenever my Rt took the "protection" role in combination with a healing monk, the results were superb.

- Xeeron

Str0b0 · May 03, 2006, 05:30 PM // 17:30

Ritualists can do the job as healers but I'd still rather have a monk. Some of the better heals require you to have spirits in play which you may or may not have the energy pool to support because ritualists have very litle in the way of energy managment skills. I have a ritualist. I know. While they can be effective I think a monk would do a better job and be able to hand out the big heals a lot faster becase they don't have to set up spirits or wait for them to expire or hold onto ashes and relics for such and such amount of time to get the full benefit. Also I think the concept of elitist dictators in a game is absolutely laughable. It sounds like someone venting some teenage anti-authoritarian angst. Knock it off please. I'm just so tired of seeing it put into text that I swear it makes me want to core my own eyes out with a rusty soup spoon just so I don't have to see it plastered on my screen anymore. Does this game favor elite players? Yes it does but duh so does any game. That's the point of being good at something because the better you are the more you get out of it. As for there being dictators well that's just stupid. They don't make you do anything. Even your whining is your own choice. This is just a thought but maybe one aspect of you not getting into groups is your "Oh Woe is me! I'm discriminated against" attitude. Yes you can heal as a ritualist. No you are not as good at it as a monk, comparable but not as good. You're a back up healer at best. That's just the way it is and if a party only needs one healer then by god I'm going with the monk over a ritualist. If a mission needs two and we have a larger party for it I would take a monk and a restore ritualist.